Harvest Bible Chapel Buffalo 135 subscribers Everything from The Chosen, Harvest Bible Chapel, 5am Writing, and more! Let the truth flow. Reported that Camp Harvest lost over $200,000 in 2016. God doesnt need Harvest and in fact Id be willing to say the spirit of Jezebel has been leading that place since the early 2000s. What makes you think you get to excuse yourself from the table? Being a first-world country has its pitfalls on several fronts not least of which is being able to find a real-deal Church of the Living God. Look to your own flocks people of HBC. none of that matters now. THis man should never be in a position of authority again, and even less in one of spiritual authority (whatever that may mean). Pre-1970 power (denominational competition for theological control of the Body of Christ), Post-1970 money (mega-madness begins, 6-figure salaries, limelight, mansions, jets). David: Fred Adams former Harvest CFO has a serious gambling addiction. Rather, as all of these spiritually abusive situations demonstrate, the flock is likely to be deceived and preyed upon by wolves in sheeps clothing. I dont have a huge problem with the idea of multiple leaders who put their necks on the line like the people in the early church serving others, and because theyre typically older and recognized as more kind and stable and servant-like, people are told to consider seriously what they have to say (about the best translation of the word unfortunately translated obey in HEB 13:17. But they wernt. If its any comfort, other steps are being taken. Otherwise, of course theyd have told us what was untrue. They should no longer be allowed to exempt themselves from the oversight which non-religious entities must abide by. And he was promoted to the XLT or whatever?? Two thousand years after that exchange, the institutional church is still struggling to define truth. Denominations have been birthed with a different twist on what they perceive truth to be. Why, dontcha know God inspired Paul to speak his thoughts, and me your trusted pastor to interpret them rightly? I hope somebody has kept good documentation somewhere of all such dealings that could be produced as evidence. So you and Dean screwed up. In a godly biblical hierarchy, what would flow downhill would be love and care. No one is forced to read comments and subject themselves to more pain, however, that discussion could help others in dealing or confronting issues. So join the club. And if the insight and oversight in wisdom and understanding must come from books or online, so be it. What we have is countless people cutting him some slack . Heres hoping quotes work the same here as many other onlline sites. Everyone who is of the Truth, who is a friend of the Truth and belongs to the Truth, hears and listens carefully to My voice. (Jesus, John 18:37). I have been following this blog for a while but have not commented until now. i take no more stock in what paul thinks than i do in what i think. I couldnt post that letter due to my absolute disgust at the depths to which MacDonald has sunk. (which for me is the whole idea. Agreed. Choose from among you seven men with good reputations, men of godly character and moral integrity, full of the Spirit and of wisdom, whom we may put in charge of this task The suggestion pleased the whole congregation; and they selected (Acts 6:5-6). The Bible is clear that all people are God's creation (Colossians 1:16), and that God loves the entire world (John 3:16), but only those who have faith (trust) in the work of Jesus are children of God (John 1:12; 11:52; Romans 8:16; 1 John 3:1-10). Culty. Does that make you manly? Sad. Someone should also dig into the incident regarding the video of Mel Gibsons Passion of the Christ that was shown to HCA ELEMENTARY school children without any warning or notice to parents. In March of 2000, Harvest Bible Chapel adopted the mission to establish Gospel-believing, Bible-teaching churches. Your newfound joy is where I, too, am seeing Gods fingerprints, and why I am holding out hope that my faith will survive. Shout it from the housetops!! of good behaviour However, he has never won . My current frustration, as someone who wants to get it right, is not knowing how to get it right in light of all the historical evidence. He is son of celebrated Left Behind author Jerry Jenkins. Director Dallas Jenkins on the Goshen, Utah, set of "The Chosen" Season 2. This was a guy who was lauded before thousands each week on the stage, promoted on a national radio program, spread his influence through 18 books. jyjames: How to do church that has nothing to do with Jesus, then. I read an article yesterday about small mainstream churches driven to the wall by the migration to the megas being forced to lease their vacant during the week facilities to small businesses in order to generate enough income to keep the doors open. I prayed for your father-in-law and your family just now. After seven years, the growing congregation of 500 raised funds in six weeks to secure a former warehouse at 800 S Rohlwing Road in Rolling Meadows. I presume this is because he has a much bigger platform, but if that is not the reason, I am open to hear. While I might be willing to grant that many elders/leaders probably start out with relatively good intentions, I suspect that the genuinely evil wolves (yes, I count MacDonald and Hybels as wolves, not fallen shepherds) are pretty good at picking out those who are most vulnerable to deception and temptation. Not just then but through darker times which subsequently came (including our own trials with another Harvest outlet). Craig French: Thanks for confirming the authenticity of the content, Dallas. New TWW post. 5And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. All who have enriched themselves in the name of serving God and on the backs of the working people are suspect, as that is certainly not what we were called to, nor a reflection of the sacrificial love of Jesus who came to serve. Someone asked How high does this go? Nice job. Every church leader should be good and honest. Having the equipment available to produce, record, and stream the services completely online, Harvest was able to continue to preach Gods Word unapologetically and worship unashamedly. The following is an extract from LookinguntoJesus.net, Presbuterous, Episkopos & Poimen Not even fit to be chair of my department at Average State U. I do sometimes wonder if we read the same Bible. The true Body of Christ answers only to Christ, the shepherds/elders as well. I am there; have been close to 8-years now. "I'm going to make mistakes. Of course, he wasnt qualified for either so I guess that didnt matter. Or would they even care? and the thought of gathering up ones gumption and taking risks is tiring. When will the madness end?! self-controlled But no matter what, it will get bent quickly if thats whats happening. The days of intermediaries are over, and we all have access to the very Spirit of God to lead us personally as he desires us to go. Its been about the cash for the last 20 years! Every weekend were gathering to open the Bible together, growing in Gods ways through community and going out to bring God glory through His Son, Jesus Christ. Crazy, huh? Ken F (aka Tweed):if these offices are wrong it means the wheels fell of of the Church extremely early in its history. How many disasters do we need to see before people ask legitimate questions? TS00: because sometimes I feel pretty alone in this wilderness. Im of course speaking about Paul. Now lets see him use his powerful personality and influence to secure real transparency, healing and change for the thousands of people he claims to care about. http://www.globalpokerindex.com/poker-players/frederick-adams-169223/. If you dont get why your letter was leaked and why people are upset, I would say youre isolated and you need to take the blinders off. So James has only paid a fraction of taxes that the rest of us little people would have had to without the luxury of the Pastor title and access to over $40M a year in donations. Not exactly the mild and loving spirit of Jesus. All three words refer to one position or office within the church, that of the elders. Kind of clueless about it, obviously, because you act like think youre making a trenchant point. Abigail: Dallas Jenkins: Neither Dean Butters nor I wanted our letters published. In destructive cults that pose as Christian megas, there is evidently an attitude of privilege and authority among those who call themselves elders that is simply nonexistent in the Bibleit seems anti-Christ, actually. We see in Scripture the importance placed upon the need to have elders. information from others can be beneficial. Dallas, you helped run an organization that prospered because of its public image which you helped create. Muslin, fka Dee Holmes: I will admit I now find it kind of shocking that a guy who never knew Jesus in life could muscle his way in and call himself an apostle among the other apostles. Or rather, a simulacrum of an ancient city. And its always dangerous when two fabrics team up. Also, your letter simply further bolsters credibility of the excellent work from the Elephants Debt and Julie Roys. Looking at the history of newer religious organizations created in the era of print is instructive and revelatory. At least we can see from this that publicizing facts online does provably result in change. Dan Claassen Thanks for the reply. . He did this knowing that I was qualified for neither. I feel like all of the verses you quoted would work just as well if it was translated the older, mature believers in the church. I see nothing denoting an office. It seems like to me that in a group of people, these things sort themselves out without anyone declaring it to be a position and appointing people to it. So it doesnt really matter what I think, I suppose but what I know has made a huge difference in my life. WHERE TO FIND US. Honest question: why does it matter what Paul thinks? In 2012, after several decades of developing the worship culture at Harvest, the Vertical Church Band was born. Well played. We celebrated Gods blessing of 100 church plants in just 14 years in 2014. id say you are beholden to the public to explain to them with all transparency. The only reason you dont want exposure is because you dont want damage to your film career. Noevangelical: As this dumpster fire continues to grow, how could anyone with a scintilla of Christianity continue to support this ministry? it has a b in it. Because MacDonald earned it. If all this was that important to the leaders they would have been apoplectic at what they witnessed from JM. Jimmy Evans, Head of Marriage Today TV & Sr Pastor and Apostle of Gateway Church, is reportedly in contact with James MacDonald. Jenkins is a former member of the Executive Leadership Team at Harvest Bible Chapel where he served as the Executive Director of Vertical Church Media. I can only guess, but I imagine that JMac and Hybels laid very clever traps, grooming and gradually leading people ever further into compromise and, eventually, outright sin. Does that make you manly? Sad. Ken F (aka Tweed): Vincent is a coward: came to an old thread less likely to be read and didnt stick around to answer for his comment. Maybe out of kindness because he didnt want to embarrass anyone too much? This is why I was born, and for this I have come into the world, to testify to the Truth. I dont have any answers. Zero current power holders at Willow Creek Community Church have uttered a single word condemning the sexual crimes of founder and 42 year leader Bill Hybels. No church will fit that ideal in this fallen world. Sorry to hear that he is now masquerading as Santa Claus Ill tell my grandchildren to be on the lookout. On a side note, Im wondering if the wealth of knowledge that you and others like Jessica Hockett possesswondering if perhaps the two of you, along with a few other key people, have considered meeting and strategizing what could be some next steps going forward to help ensure that Gods people will never again be fleeced by the likes of James MacDonald, Luke MacDonald, Rick Donald, Jeff Donaldson, and, if it comes down to it, Donald Duck. It has been a comfort reading here (and at TED, Julie Roys, and other sites revealing the truth) of others who are working through this. You should make your case by offering proof. Since then, the output of Christ-adoring songs from various worship team members has continued to accelerate. Max: This is why I was born, and for this I have come into the world, to testify to the Truth. Very useful and informative. Its your choiceAnonymity is not the same thing as cowardice, but thanks so much for playing that tired old game. We share the common goal of wanting the abuse to stop. God bless your father-in-law. ++++++++++++++++++++. At Harvest, the elders oversee the doctrine, direction, and discipline of the church. In an interview with the Chicago Sun Times, Jenkins said, "We feel like if people can binge watch . But if it is from God, you will not be able to stop them (Acts 5:38-39). What would have been the point to allow comments after asking that? Years later, the church long ago destroyed by heavy abuse and the former members scattered, a number of them atheists today, that drama pastor is now into the New Age. If I were you, I would review what happened at Mars Hill and the Mark Driscoll implosion. The daughter of Matt Slick (big-gun-reformed-apologist) converted to fundamental atheism. James mocking his own flock with his outrageous private Cabo party to end all parties, with the $50,000 magician, wont go unanswered. This moved the church into a season of transitional leadership for the next 27 months. And who on this blog doesnt love questions to be answered and truth to be revealed. Cudos for your honesty. Who are you to tell people to shut up anyway? It is difficult to not imagine that the overly generous salaries passed out at Harvest have a lot to do with the leaders who refuse to call for the opening of the books. Harvest Bible Chapel is a large evangelical organization with congregations across the metro Chicago area. I am watching the SBC be accused of following in the footsteps of the pedophile priests of the Catholic Church. But please, enough with the Evil Baddy-Bad-Bad Constantine Nonsense. The Story of Alleged Abuse at Sankey Orphanage in the Philippines and Its Relationship to Christ Community Chapel, Tom Randall, and Joe Coffey, Former Harvest Bible Chapel Members Want $72,000 In Donations Refunded, After Pastor James MacDonaldFired, https://swbts.edu/news/releases/game-banquet-uses-hunting-venue-spread-gospel/, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IwSTe9uit48, http://churchbuildingministry.org/who-we-are/, https://duckduckgo.com/?q=the+chosen+producers+james+macdonald&t=ffsb&ia=web, http://www.wsop.com/players/profile/?playerid=72494, http://www.globalpokerindex.com/poker-players/frederick-adams-169223/, https://classroom.synonym.com/the-role-of-the-clergy-in-the-greek-orthodox-church-12087637.html, https://www.archbalt.org/clergy-personnel-division/bishops-priests-deacons/. Always dangerous when two fabrics team up many disasters do we need to have elders m to. This ministry as this dumpster fire continues to grow, how could with... 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